Posted by jonvon on April 15, 2002 at 12:29:26:
In Reply to: Re: Quandary... posted by john on April 15, 2002 at 07:42:39:
I think its time we figure out how to take it to the next level. Maybe this discussion is better done face to face with everyone around, but I want to throw something out so we can start thinking about it. Here is an idea.
What if everyone could shoot for like 20 bucks on a sunday? For a lot of us, I bet we could find a way to do that. If 30 people gave this amount, that would be 600 a week. Break this out to 52 weeks a year, that is 31,200. I know that people aren't going to give every single week and all that, but I'm just trying to get my head around this. And we really need to have a reality check here. Things can't continue the way they have been. Steve has been giving his life to this thing here in our town for what, 6+ years? Something like that. The entire time we have never really supported him. I think its time to make a change in our priorities. I'm speaking to myself more than anyone. I want to move ahead into something real. Its time that I made a commitment.
Ok, lets look at it. Steve is a guy who does a lot of stuff. He does the accounting. He leads the band in the afternoon service. Not only from a musical standpoint but as a worship leader as well. Both of these services together, we could pay 60k for in a year, easily. Not only that but he moderates and (when we are gracious enough to leave him time) preaches in the service. For this he ought to be making at least 40k, in my opinion. We all know he is worth more.
So 20 bucks a week... starts to look like not a whole lot. I don't know how it all works, but I'm sure that not all of that will go right back to Steve.
Paula and I are going to do what we can. Other people might not be able to give 20, but we ought to at least be looking at the equation. What will it take to make things right? What do we need to do? If its going to dinner vs. doing the right thing for a man who has given a huge portion of his life to us, maybe we could all chip in and buy some spagetti and everyone could come over and we'll eat at our place. Or over at Steve's or whatever.
Please don't take any of this personally, when it comes to dinner vs. giving to the church, I am chief among sinners. For a really long time I have had a fundamental distrust of ministry in general. When I stopped believing in it after giving faithfully for a lot of years I stopped giving. A lot of us are like that, and Steve has been here for us for a long time. Many of us are kind of like orphans in a way, outcasts of a subculture that just doesn't work for us. So we want to sit around writing dark poetry and smoking cloves and whatnot. Well maybe that is an exaggeration, but its not too far off. Something is happening in me lately, I think after all this time something is maybe getting healed in me. Or maybe I'm just tired of shaking my fist in the air or something, I don't know. Maybe being a father has something to do with it. Its hard to tell. But anyway I want to shoulder the responsibility that is mine, whatever that might be. Everyone else can shoulder theirs, whatever that is.
At the end of the day we are building something together if we can do this.
: I understand and I admit that we often just don't have the money. I won't make excuses, but we give when we can. Yesterday was either give or go to dinner, we went to dinner. As for the frustration you and Steve feel, i have a real suggestion. Don't bear the burden on your own. The service is ours. I had no idea Steve was paying the sitters out of his pocket. I would have forgone dinner to stop that. And as Steve said yesterday, the workers are worthy of their hire. So you guys don't have to pay for anything. This will force us to pick up the slack. Of course, there may be a few weeks where the things we're used to just don't show up, and all you have to do is say we didn't have the money. I'm serious. This way either we pick up the responsibility or it closes down, but you guys definitely don't need to keep carrying us all. Sometimes the only way to learn is to force us to endure some hard knocks.
: Maybe try this. Next week you say the costs are: xxx for: abc. If the money isn't there, A, B, and C will not be available next week. Then that's it. We'll either do it or we won't.